This is a discussion on NL Cy Young: Is it really even a question who is the leading candidate? within the S3F Original Articles and Podcasts forum at Strike 3 Forums; I agree with Dave. It is irrational to evaluate an individual based solely on past ...

Hmark6 · 10-21-2005, 04:08 PM

I agree with Dave. It is irrational to evaluate an individual based solely on past team success or failure, becuase teams achieve wins, not individuals. The only way to evaluate individual players is by comparing their individual stats. Elementary!

joek · 10-21-2005, 04:14 PM

That is your opinion, well expressed, and you are welcome to it.

I have a differing opinion, an opinion that lauds and acknowledges ALL players of the winning team for accomplishing the goal for why the game is played, WINNING. There are many great players, and it is all to easy to blame the other players of a team for losing. That is a cop out and an excuse for the team not winning. They win because they are not the best. The greatest players WIN with their team mates and all are given the accolades they deserve. There is no question, basebal is a team game, and the best players make the best team. Point being a .250 hitter can help his team more the .300 hitter. The 70 RBI player can help his team more than the 100 RBI guy. Etc. etc. Winning is worth determines greatness, not an individuals stats. We see things differently, but my end result is I give credit to those who WIN and laud all the players, while you may give credit to those who lose or their individual effort and then blame the other guys for making the team lose.

Hmark6 · 10-21-2005, 04:27 PM

Originally Posted by joek

That is your opinion, well expressed, and you are welcome to it.

I have a differing opinion, an opinion that lauds and acknowledges ALL players of the winning team for accomplishing the goal for why the game is played, WINNING. There are many great players, and it is all to easy to blame the other players of a team for losing. That is a cop out and an excuse for the team not winning. They win because they are not the best. The greatest players WIN with their team mates and all are given the accolades they deserve. There is no question, basebal is a team game, and the best players make the best team. Point being a .250 hitter can help his team more the .300 hitter. The 70 RBI player can help his team more than the 100 RBI guy. Etc. etc. Winning is worth determines greatness, not an individuals stats. We see things differently, but my end result is I give credit to those who WIN and laud all the players, while you may give credit to those who lose or their individual effort and then blame the other guys for making the team lose.

I'm not lauding losers. I'm just pointing out that your theory (which is quickly becoming merely a conjecture) is flawed, incomplete, contradictory, and irrational.

joek · 10-21-2005, 06:05 PM

That is your opinion, all be it grossly wrong. The WIN METHOD is based on fact and reality. It credits all winners who have helped their team be the best they can be. If you find that """""flawed, incomplete, contradictory, and irrational,"""""" that is your opinion, and you and others are welcome to it. Fortunately, in the real world, and with people who truly matter, have wisdom, and wish to win, it is an overwhelming success.

DiamondDave · 10-22-2005, 10:18 AM

Don't let the door hit you, where the good Lord split you

Hmark6 · 10-24-2005, 11:48 AM

Fortunately for this forum, the Win Method lost.

ejk · 10-28-2005, 10:20 AM

As the WIN METHOD continues its dominance as the greatest evaluation tool ever devised, the best team with the best players for the 2006 baseball season are the Chicago White Sox. Yet another American League team who has helped dominate the inferior nl teams for the pas 100+ years. When will the nl win a WS game again?

General · 10-28-2005, 10:46 AM

Joek, I thought you left.

ejk · 10-28-2005, 10:53 AM

Hate to shake you up, one of the most ignorant, but I am ejk. joek is on the road interviewing prospective free agents. I realize it is hard for ignorant people to comprehend the concept of different posters, since your crew of creedants appear to post and demean, as one. ESAD

Hmark6 · 10-28-2005, 07:28 PM

Originally Posted by ejk

joek is on the road interviewing prospective free agents.

If by "on the road" you mean never welcome back, then yes you're right. Joe got booted because he's a flaming idiot.

Originally Posted by ejk

I realize it is hard for ignorant people to comprehend the concept of different posters.

Its not hard to comprehend his concept. We've done that, and offered contradictory opinions that JoeK couldn't comprehend. Your stubbornness and condescension sound very familiar, Joe ..err I mean ejk.

missionhockey21 · 10-28-2005, 10:31 PM

This article topic has been covered thoroughly and now it's left up to the voters to decide. Since the thread direction has shifted course so much it's best just to close this since I think everyone who wanted to argue their view has had the time to done so and now it's just getting off-topic.

love_that_reefer

I am pretty sure Joek was Hank Steinbrenner at this point. And thank god writers prevailed and gave Carpenter the award. The work horse won out!!